Providence

Providence is a LARP game using Trent Yacuk's Kingdom Come system. It is a game of Fallen Angels and their struggle to survive against the forces of Heaven and Hell and some things in between.

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    Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

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    cenobyte
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    Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by cenobyte on Fri 15 Jan 2010 - 11:40

    Hey folks.

    I've been thinking about this a lot, and I've been considering the input I've had from you (for which I am very grateful). Some of you are interested in a focus group that would test out some of the proposed changes to the rules, and if I have 3-4 folks interested in it, I will run a focus group sometime. Most likely not at a game, and most likely it will be at Chez Relaxo.

    As to the other rules changes, what I've heard from you is that you would prefer to play with the rules we have (ie. the BRB) until such time as the book is ready for publication. If this is an accurate representation of what you'd like to see, then I will do my best to make sure that the rules we *do* have (ie. the BRB) are clear, concise, and available. I am not certain what's going to happen vis the Setting information; hopefully I can make some of that available as well.

    Trent and I are still talking about some of the things he would like to still modify, and when we get to a point where we can put all of them together and offer a complete set of the rules, I'm sure he'll do that.

    What does this mean in terms of playtesting?

    I'm not sure. It's exceedingly difficult (as you know) to playtest with a changing system. And there are some changes that have been playtested elsewhere but which aren't ready to be released "in full". so we're kind of in a sort of holding pattern, I think.

    My question to you is this: when the final set of rules (knock on wood) is ready, would you prefer a new chronicle (you all get to make new characters), or would you prefer to 'reset' the characters you have?

    P.S. I have locked all of the Forums posts that discuss the proposed rules changes.


    Last edited by cenobyte on Mon 3 May 2010 - 16:41; edited 1 time in total
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    Corral

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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by Corral on Fri 15 Jan 2010 - 19:40

    I think that might depend on just how much has changed, and possibly on what's going on with each character at the time it happens.

    Is there a third choice wherein we each get to decide individually, so that some characters remain the same but whoever wants to get hit by a meteor or something can do that instead?
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    cenobyte
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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by cenobyte on Fri 15 Jan 2010 - 20:17

    I think the third choice would be difficult to implement if there are changes that are, say, "No more Infected Trauma" and your character has had some. Or "Your Warfare stat is totally decided differently". But we'll talk about this when it happens, okay?
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    Shamus

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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by Shamus on Fri 15 Jan 2010 - 21:36

    cenobyte wrote:

    My question to you is this: when the final set of rules (knock on wood) is ready, would you prefer a new chronicle (you all get to make new characters), or would you prefer to 'reset' the characters you have?

    P.S. I have locked all of the Forums posts that discuss the proposed rules changes.

    Idea: How about giving folks the option of either making something new OR making a new character? I am fine with it either way. But i think if there are going to be significant changes, then resetting the chronicle might bean idea. i am not saying that's how i would go but if a lot of people are making a new character that might be the best time to reset. and people at that point could just have the ability to 'remake' their character.
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    Eliel

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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by Eliel on Fri 15 Jan 2010 - 22:36

    I like a fully new chronicle. My second choice would be a rebuild of all characters. My last choice would be the half and half option where some build new and some keep old.

    My vote is also that this not occur until the FINAL rulebook is done and available to everyone (including setting) and will not change.


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    Eliel

    He who would make his own liberty secure must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself". -Thomas Paine, philosopher and writer (1737-1809)
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    cenobyte
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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by cenobyte on Fri 15 Jan 2010 - 22:41

    Joey, what's the difference between "making something new Or making a new character"?

    Or did you mean "making something new or keeping your old character"?
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    Shamus

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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by Shamus on Sat 16 Jan 2010 - 10:12

    cenobyte wrote:Joey, what's the difference between "making something new Or making a new character"?

    Or did you mean "making something new or keeping your old character"?

    yeah....that. give an old dude a break, i am losing it in my ancientness.
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    cenobyte
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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by cenobyte on Sat 16 Jan 2010 - 10:37

    I just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something.
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    Corral

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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by Corral on Sat 16 Jan 2010 - 10:59

    I suspect that any changes that would make it hard to let some people reset their character would also make it hard to let everyone just reset their character.

    But 'k.
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    cenobyte
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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by cenobyte on Sat 16 Jan 2010 - 13:06

    Actually, Laura, what I was getting at wasn't that it would be particularly *difficult* to reset a character, but that it would be difficult to integrate some reset characters with others, if not impossible, because you wouldn't be comparing the same numbers/stats in some cases (f'rinstance, if Warfare changes).
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    Friedrich
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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by Friedrich on Sat 16 Jan 2010 - 14:28

    Jill, what do you mean by 'reset'?
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    Bal

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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by Bal on Sat 16 Jan 2010 - 15:35

    I don't think it is particularly difficult to say "Okay, your character has had a total of 93 Zeal go into them thus far(including creation points) - remake them on a budget of 93 Zeal in the new system, but try to keep close to the spirit of the old character and their capabilities". That should probably be the bare minimum for everyone if we switch over to a new system, everyone gets a rebuild.

    Or, depending on when this happens, could just close down the chronicle and start a new one. It is probably a ways off before all those changes are out, anyway, so there is a good chance by the time it happens it will be time to wrap up plots, and give everything a resolution anyway.
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    Corral

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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by Corral on Sat 16 Jan 2010 - 16:21

    Oh! You misunderstood me. Or perhaps me, you. Anyway, as I understood the options:

    1. Everyone makes a new character for a new chronicle
    2. Everyone remakes their old character and we keep playing the same chronicle

    I was suggesting that

    3. Some do #1, some do #2

    and not that any of us keep our characters under the old/current system. ("some characters remain the same" was perhaps a poor way to say "some characters are remade with the same personality").
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    cenobyte
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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by cenobyte on Sat 16 Jan 2010 - 19:42

    AH YES.
    That makes MUCH more sense.
    However, now I am confused as to how people could do both; wouldn't that make 2 games?
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    Corral

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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by Corral on Sat 16 Jan 2010 - 22:51

    I guess I meant the same story, but some people can bring in brand new characters if they feel their old one would be broken (in a bad way) by the application of the new rules. We could come up with some in-plot reason why a bunch of Fallen are gone.
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    cenobyte
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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by cenobyte on Sun 17 Jan 2010 - 0:30

    Ohhhhh. Okay.
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    Eliel

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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by Eliel on Sun 17 Jan 2010 - 14:26

    The half and half approach leads to some problems plot-wise. Where did all the old characters go? Why is there a sudden influx of new fallen? Do these two mysteries become the primary plot for the chronicle, or is it written into the game write-up what happened between the games that explains it?

    Balance wise you also have some difficulties in that there will be dramatic point imbalances between new and old characters.

    These can both be overcome, but the half and half method effectively is the same as option 2, "Everyone remakes their old character and we keep playing the same chronicle", since I am assuming if we went with that choice, Jill probably wouldn't tell people they are forbidden from retiring their character.


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    Eliel

    He who would make his own liberty secure must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself". -Thomas Paine, philosopher and writer (1737-1809)
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    cenobyte
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    Re: Rules Changes II - Return of Rules Changes

    Post by cenobyte on Sun 17 Jan 2010 - 14:44

    Good points, Dave.
    Although if the question is "could some people make a *new* character that is essentially the same in personality/background/goals as their old character", I don't think *that* would be a problem, as long as there is some way to wrangle the stories of the old characters, plots, etc..

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